Questions on Hyper-V Hosting
- Thread starter AndyLL
- Start date
AndyLL
Perch
Ok... so I can get SQL Server installed on either the main Hyper VPS or a 2nd VPS when my site grows large enough?
In another post you said the 2 servers could be tied together as a private network.
Is that true with Virtuozzo also or is it only the Hyper VPS that can do that?
I'm rolling out a new project early next year. I'm trying to convince my partner that Jodo can support the growth he expects in the 1st year or 2.
Andy
I would not use Virtuozzo at this point for any project to be quite honest, Hyper-V blows it away in every way imaginable!
While we could make a private network between virtuozzo, we've never done it, and it would be less useful than the hyper-v private network. We have done the Hyper-v private network for ourselves and clients already.
You can get it installed anytime, and also add/remove management plans at any time, no monthly commitment to them, just once work is done it is charged for that month, and can't be reversed in that month (barring some big mistake/problem/dissatisfaction, and we'd work to correct that and make you happy)
Virtuozzo has a much worse uptime than the Hyper-V platform(it needs more reboots to clear issues, one user can impact others in a big way), and Hyper-v allows true isolation, independent OS updates, debugging tools etc.
The minor downside to Hyper-V is that there is no integrated backup in the control panel to take backups of your VPS, so you need to either use an external cloud backup, FTP backup, or use our iSCSI service at a nominal charge. With the iSCSI network to Hyper-V you can use windows server backup for bare metal backups.
While we could make a private network between virtuozzo, we've never done it, and it would be less useful than the hyper-v private network. We have done the Hyper-v private network for ourselves and clients already.
You can get it installed anytime, and also add/remove management plans at any time, no monthly commitment to them, just once work is done it is charged for that month, and can't be reversed in that month (barring some big mistake/problem/dissatisfaction, and we'd work to correct that and make you happy)
Virtuozzo has a much worse uptime than the Hyper-V platform(it needs more reboots to clear issues, one user can impact others in a big way), and Hyper-v allows true isolation, independent OS updates, debugging tools etc.
The minor downside to Hyper-V is that there is no integrated backup in the control panel to take backups of your VPS, so you need to either use an external cloud backup, FTP backup, or use our iSCSI service at a nominal charge. With the iSCSI network to Hyper-V you can use windows server backup for bare metal backups.
AndyLL
Perch
I would not use Virtuozzo at this point for any project to be quite honest, Hyper-V blows it away in every way imaginable!
One thing that has kept me from moving my current 2 VPSs to the Hyper-V and makes me a little nervous about implimenting this project on the Hyper-V is the support charges.
As you know... with my current two Virtuozzo VPSs it seems every month something happens that requires me to contact support.
I have service issues (that don't fix themselves on reboot), RDC issues, Plesk panel issues and VPS node issues.
Some I assume I should be dealing with myself since it's an unmanaged VPS but a decent number of them seem to require a Jodo Support Tech to fix.
These days... if a VPS reboot doesn't fix the issue I tend to just contact support since it's just as like to be a node problem.
If I go to the Hyper-V for this new project will I be getting a ton of $20-$35 charges for every support email I send?
Andy
One thing that has kept me from moving my current 2 VPSs to the Hyper-V and makes me a little nervous about implimenting this project on the Hyper-V is the support charges.
As you know... with my current two Virtuozzo VPSs it seems every month something happens that requires me to contact support.
I have service issues (that don't fix themselves on reboot), RDC issues, Plesk panel issues and VPS node issues.
Some I assume I should be dealing with myself since it's an unmanaged VPS but a decent number of them seem to require a Jodo Support Tech to fix.
These days... if a VPS reboot doesn't fix the issue I tend to just contact support since it's just as like to be a node problem.
If I go to the Hyper-V for this new project will I be getting a ton of $20-$35 charges for every support email I send?
Andy
Those issues, simply haven't been happening on Hyper-V, even with plesk
I attribute many of the issues at this point, simply to the way virtuozzo works. We have at least 60% of the hyper-v base using Plesk, and I know of maybe 3 problems with plesk on any of them, beyond the first 24 hours just getting used to it.Virtuozzo is also unmanaged, and we charge for support on it at $3 per incident as long as less than 15 minutes, yet how many times have we charged you? Maybe once?
If the issue looks to be something you didn't do, or a plesk problem, we generally DO NOT charge, if you need spamaalalalal help, app specific help etc, we have always charged, and in fact on the Hyper-V side it is cheaper with some plans than Virutozzo at 45/hr
AndyLL
Perch
I'm probably go with the Hyper-V.
I assume the timeframes to setup a VPS is about the same as with Virtuozzo.
I also assume I can just start with the low-end plan and upgrade quickly as my website grows.
I'm only going to have one live domain on here... I see no reason to have Plesk installed.
I assume the timeframes to setup a VPS is about the same as with Virtuozzo.
I also assume I can just start with the low-end plan and upgrade quickly as my website grows.
I'm only going to have one live domain on here... I see no reason to have Plesk installed.
There is a downtime to upgrade, as they cannot do Hard drive live expansion like Virtuozzo, and sometimes it is required to change nodes if upgrading since we do limit the amount of VPSes.
Setup timeframe....eh we've been selling out a bit, and right now hard drives are a tough situation, we have a big order coming in but the hard drives got canceled on it as they 'ran out of stock' between order and shipping (5-6 hours)
We however do have room for a lite or value plan.
AndyLL
Perch
Is the upgrade downtime hours or days? In theory I could run the site off of one of my current VPSs during the downtime but that's always risky trying to do something like that.
The site goes live Jan 1,2012 so I was planning to purchase early/mid december.
I was just going to start with the lite and upgrade as needed but might revaluate now.
Not days
normally 1 hour maybe 2, as long as you do not take any volume snapshots.
The longest we had was someone that had volume snapshots and it ended up being over 600GB of data to export out, and they arent even good to use, they are not viable backups and take too long to work with, as well as take too much space.
And it can be scheduled on your time.
AndyLL
Perch
Now that I've signed up I'll ask a question I should have asked before.
The OS-Level support plan seemed to best match what I had on the Virtuozzo VPS... basically mananged windows updates/security.
That's what I was gonna choose because I can setup IIS and .Net.
However since I want to do WebsitePanel instead of Plesk I choose the Stack-Level plan since I don't want to set it up.
So my questions is....
After setup, what exactly am I getting for that extra $15/month.
It seems like all I'm getting is backups which since I am running only one domain doesn't seem necessary.
Am I getting a higher level support without having to pay per incident?
Andy
The OS-Level support plan seemed to best match what I had on the Virtuozzo VPS... basically mananged windows updates/security.
That's what I was gonna choose because I can setup IIS and .Net.
However since I want to do WebsitePanel instead of Plesk I choose the Stack-Level plan since I don't want to set it up.
So my questions is....
After setup, what exactly am I getting for that extra $15/month.
It seems like all I'm getting is backups which since I am running only one domain doesn't seem necessary.
Am I getting a higher level support without having to pay per incident?
Andy
ok
first Websitepanel is free, so we aren't charging 'for it' exactly, just for the installation and setup time. As long as you keep the Stack plan, you also get 100GB of iSCSI network storage, this is primarily for us to take backups, but you can use it a bit yourself as well.
You get support without having to pay per incident, yes. If you decide you don't want a support plan, you can keep the 100Gb iSCSI and manage backups and updates on your own as well, but there will be a fee (I am sorry, will need to contact sales I don't have that in front of me now) I think it is something like $15 for the 100Gb iSCSI space, but I will point out this thread to sales and try to get a confirmation.
There is no monthly commitment to any support plans, just that some like stack, do come with features that will be removed if you drop it.
I was going to say welcome to you as well since I saw a copy of your signup question mail
AndyLL
Perch
Well... they sent me a screen shot of the task manager processes which didn't really answer my question.
So lets see:
Website Panel:
WPEnterpriseServer - 70M
WPServer - 52M
InetMgr.exe - 31M ( this is not running on my other plesk VPS )
WSP VM - 7M
SQL Server Express - 25M
Total - 185M
VPS running Plesk 10 (also has IIS7)
Paralles Server - 8M
I don't see any thing else plesk is using.
Am I seeing that correctly? about 175M more to use Website Panel?
So lets see:
Website Panel:
WPEnterpriseServer - 70M
WPServer - 52M
InetMgr.exe - 31M ( this is not running on my other plesk VPS )
WSP VM - 7M
SQL Server Express - 25M
Total - 185M
VPS running Plesk 10 (also has IIS7)
Paralles Server - 8M
I don't see any thing else plesk is using.
Am I seeing that correctly? about 175M more to use Website Panel?
InetMgr, is the management gui.
Also this is real windows, not virtuozzo, which means when it 'runs out' or RAM it is NOT going to just crash and burn like Virtuozzo does. It uses a bit more memory as it doesn't have the same shared node file system for system files like a Virtuozzo VPS.
1GB with HyperV is very usable to get going, but it is not just loads of free memory or anything
I think you mean 100MB, and since Websitepanel on a single server has to use all 3 portions of the install on a single server install, it may use more. Plesk on virutozzo is virtualized with the same means as windows in the template, so the VPS instance on virtuozzo with plesk uses less memory than it will on Hyper-V as well. Once you add a server you can install just one portion of the websitepanel communications engine and it uses virtually nothing, then add it to the WSP cluster for management. So the first server uses the most, and any server added thereafter is virtually no usage (10MB or less for sure)
That being said, in the end it evens out because when Virtuozzo runs out of memory, it sends your vps into a black hole of doom, sites die, RDP doesn't work, and you have to ticket to us, on Hyper-V, everything stays up and maybe just gets slightly slower, and the world goes on.
On a daily basis, we get 3x more tickets for Virtuozzo problems now than we get for Hyper-V servers, and we now have more about an equal number of customer facing deployments, and some private whole node for their VM server deployments for customers that would tip it to more Hyper-V than Virutozzo.
AndyLL
Perch
Rright now wpserver is 120M and wpenterprise server is 70m.
And sql server is eating up another 25M.
So over 200M
When I run the panel WPPanel takes up another 62M.
I saw it over 300m earlier.
I'm torn. I dislike plesk and like the idea of one control panel to manage multiple servers but I've seen reports of WPServer going up to 1-4 Gig since 1.2.0 came out.
We can install plesk if you want, at least websitepanel can be uninstalled, Plesk cannot (seriously these genius minds made no uninstall means!)
AndyLL
Perch
We can install plesk if you want, at least websitepanel can be uninstalled, Plesk cannot (seriously these genius minds made no uninstall means!)
Really? Plesk has no uninstall? Stupid.
I'm going to think on it for a day.
I don't have the ability to babysit the server during they day so I'll probably switch. I assume plesk is more stable on Hyper-V then it is on Virtuozzo.
I haven't touched the VPS yet so if I do decide to go with plesk it can be wiped if that is easier.
Andy