Download speeds - need a few 2nd opinions :)

Customer Support Customer Only Discussion
21

Yes but think about it Stephen - even if I had dialup I should be downloading at 55Kbs. If it was 33 on dialup I’d still be wondering why it was a bit slow.

I assume they have some kind of broadband, so unless they were downloading something at the time it should be performing better than that, don’t you think? You can always ask them to test it compared to another server or serivce provider.

So, to ask you directly now - what steps are you taking to diagnose this, and is there anything I/we can do to help? Sorry to get out the pokey stick, but you haven’t provided any answers or suggestions as yet and this is dragging on.

poke :slight_smile:

22

Let’s be sure we are using the same terms here. The speeds I quoted earlier were in KiloBytes per secoond (kB/s), not Kilobits (kb/s). So the 40k I quoted earlier equates to roughly 400 kilobits per second. If I use dial-up for the same file, I get 6kB/s - approx 50kb/s

So if in NZ I can get can download a file from JH at 400kb/s. while in Australia the best for the same file is 30kb/s, then I really think the situation is totally outside Jodo’s control.

Possibly congestion at a gateway into Aus?

FYI. My broadband connection Data Rate is 4736kb/s down and 736kb/s up.

23

Ah yes this is a good point to make, the b or B makes a big difference.
33KB/s in the office is actually quite good, it is not quite the max that can be done, but being shared among all the techs it is pretty speedy as well.

However I am not that happy with the speeds either, but have been unable to find any real reason for it being less than stellar.

My thinking is really starting to fall along some ISP QoS traffic shaping may be turning it down some while they are not shaping FTP services. However it doesn’t make sense that in some cases it does not shape traffic on some servers, but does on others. I have some ideas on this but will discuss with Antic and jpveen(two that have this issue regularly on one server) and see if I can come up with a reason for this to be happening.

24

Thanks guys, all valid points. Sorry for the long post here, but bear with me…

I’ve run a test using sites on 3 windows servers - Win7, Win22 and Win11 - to see if there’s any difference between them. All had the same results, as follows:

Server: Win7
File Location: http://www.activeorg.com/AliceSpringsMaps.zip
FTP Upload: 24KB/sec
FTP Download: 190KB/sec
HTTP Download: 28KB/sec

Server: Win22
File Location: http://www.asainc.net.au/AliceSpringsMaps.zip
FTP Upload: 24KB/sec
FTP Download: 170KB/sec
HTTP Download: 26KB/sec

Server: Win11
File Location: http://www.asm2008.org/AliceSpringsMaps.zip
FTP Upload: 24KB/sec
FTP Download: 180KB/sec
HTTP Download: 27KB/sec

All speeds in KBytes/sec. As you can see, there’s a great disparity between FTP and HTTP download speeds, as if HTTP is being throttled. If NZKiwi or someone could verify HTTP speeds by downloading these 3 files, that would be a big help.

Now… a Tracert to one of the servers goes thru Singtel, Global Crossing and finally Internap, as follows:

Tracing route to www.asm2008.org [204.14.108.85]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1     1 ms    <1 ms     1 ms  192.168.1.254
  2    16 ms    15 ms    16 ms  nexthop.wa.ii.net [203.59.14.16]
  3    16 ms    19 ms    16 ms  gi2-6.per-qv1-bdr2.ii.net [203.215.4.74]
  4    75 ms    76 ms    76 ms  gi0-15-1-1.syd-stl-core1.ii.net [203.215.20.66]

  5    76 ms    76 ms    78 ms  202.139.19.37
  6   234 ms   233 ms   235 ms  203.208.191.213
  7   233 ms   236 ms   232 ms  ge-0-0-0-0.laxow-dr1.ix.singtel.com [203.208.171
.65]
  8   233 ms   232 ms   232 ms  203.208.145.102
  9   289 ms   290 ms   291 ms  te1-1-10G.ar1.MIA2.gblx.net [67.17.108.62]
 10   289 ms   288 ms   289 ms  INTERNAP.Tengigabitethernet2-2.ar1.MIA2.gblx.net
 [64.212.16.166]
 11   289 ms   290 ms   290 ms  border5.pc2.bbnet2.mia003.pnap.net [69.25.0.77]

 12   296 ms   296 ms   296 ms  webhosting-9.border5.mia003.pnap.net [216.52.162
.66]
 13   296 ms   296 ms   296 ms  64.71.225.26
 14   296 ms   296 ms   298 ms  204.14.108.85

So, I decided to find files to download from each of these networks. They all down at high speeds, as follows. (I know PDF isn’t ideal as there may be some transfer-compression going on, but I couldn’t find any ZIPs):

File on Singtel server: http://home.singtel.com/mio/2700HGV-User-Guide.pdf
HTTP Download: over 180KB/sec

File on Global Crossing server: Legal | Lumen Technologies
HTTP Download: over 150KB/sec

File on an Internap server: http://www.internap.com/about/casestudies/Orvis/orvis.pdf.pdf
HTTP Download: over 200KB/sec

Just to check where that last Internap file really is, a Tracert to “www.internap.com” follows the same route as to my Jodo servers. Singtel, GlobalX, Internap:

Tracing route to www.internap.com [64.94.4.195]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    <1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.1.254
  2    16 ms    16 ms    16 ms  nexthop.wa.ii.net [203.59.14.16]
  3    16 ms    15 ms    15 ms  gi2-6.per-qv1-bdr2.ii.net [203.215.4.74]
  4    75 ms    76 ms    76 ms  gi0-15-1-0.syd-stl-core1.ii.net [203.215.20.64]

  5    76 ms    77 ms    76 ms  202.139.19.37
  6   234 ms   235 ms   234 ms  203.208.191.213
  7   232 ms   233 ms   232 ms  ge-0-0-0-0.laxow-dr1.ix.singtel.com [203.208.171
.65]
  8   232 ms   233 ms   233 ms  203.208.145.102
  9     *        *      278 ms  Internap-Atlanta.TenGigabitEthernet3-4.ar5.ATL1.
gblx.net [207.218.80.218]
 10   279 ms   277 ms   278 ms  border5.pc1-bbnet1.acs.pnap.net [64.94.0.10]
 11   278 ms     *      278 ms  www.internap.com [64.94.4.195]

To be fair about transfer-compression, I uploaded that same Internap PDF (“orvis.pdf.pdf”) to one of my Jodo servers. It’s here: http://www.activeorg.com/orvis.pdf.pdf

Download speed of that file from the Jodo server was 27KB/sec.

That’s about as far as I can think of going with testing this. My question for Stephen is… where does the problem seem to lie now? Because I sure can’t see any slowdown occurring before it gets to your servers. Maybe you should have a chat with Internap? :slight_smile:

25

What I was saying is there could be a traffic shaping happening upon the server to your ISP due to usage of this server there, as it is not duplicated by me even, I just downloaded the files there.
Also we are using MS FTP that is built into IIS, which is also not throttled.
I just downloaded those in your links at 32-56KB/s which was the same speeds I got from the internap link you gave, due to me being on mobile broadband that is about right during this time of day and the signal I have (weak EVDO)

I have some ideas on why traffic shaping may be happening about to PM you and jpveen both on it for checking.

26

That wouldn’t explain everyone else’s results though, unless all our ISPs hold your servers in disrepute. :slight_smile:

timruns: 70kb/sec from Pacific Northwest USA.
Manish: 33KB/sec New Delhi, India
Penhall: 62kb/sec in Northern Canada
mirtheil: 72KB/sec from Texas
Stephen: 6KB/s on mobile broadband card with 1 bar of signal on 1xRTT network. :wink:
silverstone: 23.6 Kbs from Malaysia
liming: 50KB/s in Virginia
Cosinus: 60kB from Romania
nzkiwi: 43k to New Zealand

That was the whole point of this thread, to eliminate that it may just be me. But there is one discrepancy!

riley: 143k to Chicago area.

I’ve PM’d riley to ask if he can give it another try and post a tracert.

27

I’ve just done some testing here, but it probably was not the best time - Friday 8:30pm NZ time. I’m sure there is some traffic shaping by my ISP at this time of the day as the download speed from my own Jodo hosted site is down on normal speeds.

http://www.activeorg.com/AliceSpringsMaps.zip: 36.3kB/s
http://www.asainc.net.au/AliceSpringsMaps.zip: 30.5kB/s

http://www.internap.com/about/casestudies/Orvis/orvis.pdf.pdf: 60.7kB/s
http://www.activeorg.com/orvis.pdf.pdf: 34.3kB/s

My web5 site:
orvis.pdf.pdf: 35.1kB/s
AliceSpringsMaps.zip: 35.2kB/s

I’ll retest at a more quiet time.

28

It’s quiet here now - I ran the tests below between 3:30 am and 3:45 am NZ Daylight saving time (GMT + 13 hours)

Weren’t able to test the files on activeorg.com and asainc.net.au as they seem to have been removed (404 error)

http://www.internap.com/about/casestudies/Orvis/orvis.pdf.pdf: 91.9kB/s

My web5 site:
orvis.pdf.pdf: 85.6kB/s (http)
orvis.pdf.pdf: 205.1kB/s (ftp)
AliceSpringsMaps.zip: 82.8kB/s (htp)

The above speeds are the average over 4 downloads. Notice that the download speed of the pdf file is not significantly different between internap.com and my web5 site

There’s no doubt that my ISP is limiting bandwidth at some hours of the day. Even ftp transfer is considerably faster in the small hours.

29

Hi nzkiwi, the files are still there on activeorg and asainc, it’s just that you have a colon “:” at the end of your links, so they’re not connecting with the files.

Can you give me a link to the orvis file on your web5 site? I’d like to see if there’s a difference in speed to mine on web7 and web22.

Notice how FTP is hugely faster. ISP’s shouldn’t be throttling HTTP, that’s denying you the service you signed up for.

30

Oops… I need new glasses :wink:

At 4:50am:

www.activeorg.com/orvis.pdf.pdf: 47.0kB/s (http)
www.internap.com/about/casestudies/Orvis/orvis.pdf.pdf: 95.8kB/s (http)
oite.co.nz/orvis.pdf.pdf: 85.1 kB/s (http)
oite.co.nz/orvis.pdf.pdf: 191.7kB/s (ftp)

31

Mine at the moment (HTTP):

www.internap.com/about/casestudies/Orvis/orvis.pdf.pdf : 200KB/s (http)
www.oite.co.nz/orvis.pdf.pdf : 200KB/s
www.activeorg.com/orvis.pdf.pdf : 28KB/s

omg.. So oite.co.nz is on Web5? It downloaded full speed, but mine (win7 and win22) are both stuck at 28KB/s when downloading.

Stephen can you look at this as a matter of urgency please! Thanks to everyone who’ve helped, all the info is right here, but it feels like nothing is being done to fix it.

Comparative Tracerts:

Tracing route to oite.co.nz [64.187.101.31]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1     1 ms    <1 ms     1 ms  192.168.1.254
  2    16 ms    16 ms    16 ms  nexthop.wa.ii.net [203.59.14.16]
  3    15 ms    16 ms    16 ms  gi2-3.per-qv1-bdr1.ii.net [203.215.4.28]
  4    72 ms    71 ms    72 ms  gi0-15-1-0.syd-ult-core1.ii.net [203.215.20.2]
  5    73 ms    71 ms    72 ms  202.139.19.33
  6   232 ms   231 ms   232 ms  203.208.191.157
  7   230 ms   230 ms   233 ms  208.50.13.185
  8   297 ms   287 ms   292 ms  te1-1-10G.ar1.MIA2.gblx.net [67.17.108.62]
  9   285 ms   285 ms   285 ms  INTERNAP.Tengigabitethernet2-2.ar1.MIA2.gblx.net
 [64.212.16.166]
 10   287 ms   285 ms   285 ms  border5.pc2.bbnet2.mia003.pnap.net [69.25.0.77]

 11   292 ms   289 ms   150 ms  gi2-3.per-qv1-bdr1.ii.net [203.215.4.28]
 12   287 ms    96 ms   193 ms  64.71.225.26
 13   287 ms   286 ms   373 ms  203.208.191.157
 14   287 ms   463 ms    53 ms  208.50.13.185
 15   287 ms   294 ms   279 ms  te1-1-10G.ar1.MIA2.gblx.net [67.17.108.62]
 16   571 ms     2 ms   284 ms  64.187.101.31

Trace complete.

---

Tracing route to activeorg.com [204.14.106.234]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1     1 ms    <1 ms     1 ms  192.168.1.254
  2    15 ms    15 ms    20 ms  nexthop.wa.ii.net [203.59.14.16]
  3   155 ms    17 ms    16 ms  gi2-3.per-qv1-bdr1.ii.net [203.215.4.28]
  4   366 ms    74 ms    73 ms  gi0-15-1-1.syd-ult-core1.ii.net [203.215.20.4]
  5    74 ms    72 ms    74 ms  202.139.19.33
  6   148 ms   232 ms   231 ms  203.208.191.157
  7    54 ms   463 ms   233 ms  208.50.13.185
  8   288 ms   294 ms   287 ms  te1-1-10G.ar1.MIA2.gblx.net [67.17.108.62]
  9     2 ms   572 ms   285 ms  INTERNAP.Tengigabitethernet2-2.ar1.MIA2.gblx.net
 [64.212.16.166]
 10   285 ms   286 ms   284 ms  border5.pc2.bbnet2.mia003.pnap.net [69.25.0.77]

 11   286 ms   287 ms   287 ms  webhosting-9.border5.mia003.pnap.net [216.52.162
.66]
 12   287 ms   286 ms   287 ms  64.71.225.26
 13   288 ms   288 ms   289 ms  204.14.106.234

Trace complete.
32

yes, oite.co.nz is on web5

33

see the problem is that we are NOT DOING anything to limit, so there is nothing we can do to ‘correct’ this

34

Stephen,

Have you TRIED accessing these two files yourself from outside the Jodo network? And I don’t mean on your mobile connection. Have you run any tests? We’re doing all the work for you here, and yet you say “nothing is wrong?”

Site oite.co.nz is on web5 has fast download - I can download a PDF file there at 200KB/s. The same file on my domain on Win7 downloads at 28KB/s.

Why??

Aren’t you interested in the fact that downloads are incredibly slow from at least one of your servers? If you can’t work out what the problem is, that’s fine, but something is obviously wrong given the above simple test.

I’ve tried to help track it down, along with the others here who have helped too, but if you’re not going to help anymore then I’ve no patience left for it. I’ll submit a ticket to have this site moved to another server and hopefully that will improve things.

Thanks

35

There is also discrepancy in HTTP download speed between Unix and Windows accounts. This may be related to the overall HTTP speed problem in some way.

I created a Unix account, and tried a download. The file is http://d2826846.AO81.activeorg.com/yui_2.5.0.zip and download speed is 80K Bytes/sec.

Any Windows server I download from, only achieves 28 KBytes/sec, e.g. http://www.asainc.net.au/yui_2.5.0.zip

Stephen, can you PLEASE continue investigating this, as there is no doubt in my mind the problem is somewhere at Jodo, given these performance differences. Unless you can show me in what way that reasoning doesn’t hold up.

That being said, 80 KB/sec still isn’t full ADSL speed anyway - FTP download is still faster for some reason. But it’s still a big difference between Windows and Unix accounts.

If my Windows servers downloaded at 80 instead of 28, it would at least be a big improvement. Why are downloads from a Windows server slower anyway?

36

I’m in Europe (the Netherlands) and I get low speeds even with FTP personally. 90-120 kB/s, with some drops to 45 kB/s, but I think that’s just my ISP having failtastic bandwidth to the USA :frowning:
The speed I get on HTTP on the same file is very similar, and this is a Windows machine (win24). It goes over 200 kB/s for short bursts at times according to wget, I also get the same drops to 45 kB/s. Both averaged at about 112 kB/s.

From my work’s datacenter I get 395 kB/s on that file using HTTP though. Pretty large difference, probably has something to do with lower latency and tcp windows :rolleyes:
That would also explain the difference between Windows and Linux, they obviously have different TCP/IP stack implementations, with probably different default window settings.

37

Thanks Subspace, yeah I’d love to know what is mainly having such a negative effect on http speed. I’d be happy even with 50KB/s but 28KB/s is pretty darn slow. I get questions and have no idea what to say.

If tcp/ip settings are the issue, would that mean HTTP could be set the same as FTP? That would be wonderful, as for some unknown reason FTP is very fast - which makes the HTTP slowness all the more strange and frustrating.

38

Nah, those settings are on a lower level. I’m not sure why it would cause a difference between FTP and HTTP, and for me it doesn’t. Once the actual file transfer starts there’s not much difference between the two from a packet point of view.

39

BTW Antic,

I have done the downloads on connections other than mobile as well, I have used DSL in TX, DSL in Miami, SoftLayer DC in Dallas and the mobile too.

40

I get ~ 100KB/s from http://www.internap.com/about/casest.../orvis.pdf.pdf
and ~ 50KB/s from www.activeorg.com/orvis.pdf.pdf
right now